François Roudié took office a few weeks ago as head of the European Union Delegation in Colombia, on the eve of the CELAC-EU Summit, which will bring together the 27 member states of the European bloc and the 33 countries of the Community of Latin American and Caribbean States.
In an interview with EL TIEMPO, the diplomat explains how the EU seeks to move from words to action with concrete projects in clean energy, sustainable transport, and security cooperation. He also analyzes the challenges of the new international context—from the climate crisis to the dispute between powers—and emphasizes the importance of “seeking joint solutions” between regions that share democratic values and a humanistic vision of development.
Let’s start by talking about your arrival in Colombia. What has been your first impression of the country?
I had been to Colombia three or four times before, mainly as a tourist. I had never worked here, and of course, the experience is completely different. The context leading up to the summit and the electoral process has greatly influenced what I have seen since my arrival. I have spent much of my time on the logistics of the summit, amid a rather polarized political environment. In addition, geopolitics absorbs us with what is happening in the Caribbean. So my first few days have been, as the saying goes, “sink or swim.” So far, I’ve been a good swimmer: I’m still afloat. What I have appreciated in these five weeks, and in the two or three missions I have been able to carry out in Guainía, Cali, and Villa de Leyva, is the quality and level of training of my interlocutors.
François Roudié gave his first interview to EL TIEMPO. Foto:Fernando Ariza. EL TIEMPO
It has been a challenge for me, because I now lead a delegation three times larger than the one I previously headed. It also represents a major management challenge, as the European Union in Colombia does everything: trade, investment, consular affairs, and, of course, political issues. And the days are short.
I am going through the settling-in phase that all diplomats go through. This is my sixth or seventh move, and there is also the issue of my family, helping them to settle in. In short, it is an extremely interesting and intense start due to the scale and volatility of what is happening in this pre-election context.
LEA TAMBIÉN
To a certain extent, I will be happy when the summit is over, and I can focus 100 percent on Colombia. My predecessor is a very good friend of mine, who has told me a lot about what he did. The context is a little different, of course, but there is a lot to build on what he and others have done: basically, support for the peace process, promotion, investment, and so on.
What will your objectives be after the summit?
My job, first and foremost, is to promote the interests of the European Union. Period. I am the ambassador of the European Union. But it is in the European Union’s interest for Colombia to do well, so that we have a good partner. So, the priority is to help implement the peace process and protect what has already been achieved, such as the JEP.
The imposition approach is not unique to Trump; it comes from many other countries. But those of us who do not believe so much in imposition and prefer negotiation are, basically, Latin America and Europe.
Second, not in order of priority, promoting more investment: more European investment, more trade with Europe in both directions and in every sense: purchasing products, investment, exchanges between people, collaboration between companies, whatever. Because this means jobs, economic activity, and shared prosperity on both sides.
Third, the internal part of my job consists of making Europeans more cohesive. That the 16 embassies that are here, plus mine, work together. I am not their boss, not at all, in any way, but I am a bit of a coordinator: seeing where we can collaborate better and be stronger together. This is important in order to have more influence in convincing the country to embrace the green, digital, and social revolution, and to understand the urgency of investing in these three dimensions.
And in social and environmental terms?
There is the whole Amazon issue. There is the whole question of what kind of society we want, particularly in relation to digital technology, to ask ourselves what kind of regulated society we want. And here there are three models: the European-humanist model; the US model, based more on individual initiative and profit; and the Chinese model, where the individual practically does not exist.
LEA TAMBIÉN
I think that the European model, with all its diversity, is much more attractive for Colombia and for Latin America. We want humanist societies, where the values of exchange, dialogue, respect, tolerance, and diversity are much stronger than the value of getting rich.
How relevant do you think the Summit is in a global context marked by geopolitical tensions?
I would say that the first geopolitical tension, which we often forget, is that of climate change and planetary changes. That is why the fact that the summit is taking place just after the climate summit is extremely relevant, because we have obvious interests in common there. Secondly, in today’s fragmented world, where multilateralism is somewhat upside down, it is precisely the Europeans and Latin America who promote negotiated, legal, and respect-based solutions. We share a similar vision which, to simplify it, is the defense of multilateralism. When a problem arises, we seek joint solutions, making mutual concessions and trying, based on empathy, to understand your vision and mine, and see what we can do together, without imposing a vision.
LEA TAMBIÉN
The vision of imposition is not unique to Trump; it comes from many other countries. But those of us who do not believe so much in imposition and prefer negotiation are, basically, Latin America and Europe. In fact, we are about to sign an agreement between the European Union and Mercosur, we have modernized the agreement with Mexico, and we are negotiating one with Colombia. And if we are negotiating, it is precisely for that reason: to seek solutions together, listening to each other’s positions and trying to build agreements. It is more tedious than imposition, yes, perhaps, but it is much more durable. In the face of global challenges, but also in the face of illegal activity and organized crime, all of which are phenomena that know no borders, the solution must be multilateral.
President Gustavo Petro at the opening of the Fourth China-CELAC Forum in May. Foto:Mauricio Moreno. EL TIEMPO
Can the summit play a role in strengthening multilateralism in crisis?
The summit allows heads of state to come together and say, “We are committed to finding joint solutions.” And that is absolutely essential. The pandemic was a clear example of how we cannot move forward unless we work together. That is why I think the summit makes a lot of sense: it serves to manage our independence and promote the kind of society we want. And I believe that the desires of Latin Americans, Caribbean people, and Europeans are quite similar: a society of freedom, solidarity, and social justice, with access to education and health care, where we can believe that our children and grandchildren will live in a world that is still habitable. That is not always a vision shared by everyone in the world. Many share it, but not all countries defend it.
Another important point is that, between one summit and the next, a great deal of work is done; it is not that nothing happens, quite the contrary. What this summit does is measure what has been done and promote what will be done in the coming years. The transatlantic relationship is an everyday relationship.
LEA TAMBIÉN
When we work on electrical connections throughout the region, on interconnections to promote renewable energy, we don’t do it at the summit: we do it between summits, every day. The same is true of the high-capacity connection for data transfer between Europe and Latin America; it’s not something that will be finalized in Santa Marta on December 9, it’s something we do 24/7. The relationship is, therefore, much more than the summit. It basically encompasses all the cooperation and investment work that we can see in Colombia, but which we also carry out in Peru, El Salvador, and Argentina. Essentially, it is about promoting green, digital, and social transition. Specifically, that means 5G, teleconnection, buses, subways, cable cars… very concrete things that are already influencing people’s daily lives.
What this summit does is take stock of what has been done and promote what is to be done in the coming years. The transatlantic relationship is an everyday relationship.
What would you do to ensure that this summit in Santa Marta does not end up being just another diplomatic photo?
If you have a medical conference, a conference of oncologists, the oncologists leave the conference with more contacts, perhaps with more skills, but they have not cured anyone during the conference, because that is not the objective. The summit is a bit like that.
The heads of state meet and issue three statements: a general policy statement, another on citizen security, and a third on the care economy. This will serve as an impetus for all the work that is being done jointly.
For example, in terms of security, we support Ameripol, which is basically a kind of Latin American Interpol. We have many programs to combat different types of trafficking. At the summit, we will also showcase all the support we are giving to electrical interconnection, basically high-capacity lines between countries.
What concrete result would make a difference?
More electrical interconnection between countries to promote renewable energy and reduce the possibility of blackouts. That is concrete. In many countries, we are also working on supercomputing and artificial intelligence, with higher-level data transmission, vaccine production, and, here in Colombia, urban transportation. We are financing Line 1 of the metro with $400 million; we will probably finance Line 2. In Cali, the commuter train. And we are about to sign a $500 million loan with Medellín to work on sanitation and public transport.
LEA TAMBIÉN
What we do with the summits, to continue my analogy with the medical conference, is to bring together the specialists, who in this case are the heads of state, to give political impetus to a bi-continental agenda: electrical connections, work on artificial intelligence, supercomputing, global data transmission, and satellite images from the European Union’s Copernicus program, which are used in disaster prevention.
We see that we share a common vision here: treating people with respect, guaranteeing their rights, and empowering them to facilitate their integration, whether in the short or long term. I get the impression that the approach to the phenomenon of migration is quite similar.
That is the regional part. But it also translates into a bilateral part, which includes issues such as public transportation, last-mile digital connectivity, water, and sanitation—more or less the big issues. So, the idea is to understand that there are bilateral and bi-regional components, that there are concrete actions that are going to change people’s lives. The summit is more of a declarative phase, a space where we insist on region-to-region cooperation.
What about the debates on trade and investment that will take place on Sunday during the Business Forum?
The idea is that entrepreneurs from the region and Europe can meet, also meet with some policy makers, and start talking about what I mentioned before: issues that are fundamentally transformational for a society.
Twenty years ago, Europe had completely congested streets and serious pollution problems, and that changed. All European cities now function around bicycles and electric buses, and traffic levels have fallen. This digital, social, and green change is much more than solar panels: these are transformations driven by businesses.
Roudié is originally from Bordeaux and has more than 18 years of experience. Foto:Courtesy of the EU Embassy in Colombia
How can we achieve this convergence between business and government?
That is why it is very important for these companies to be present, and, of course, I would like the summit to also serve as a kind of business roundtable. They are not coming here to sign contracts, but they are coming to get to know each other and discover that they have common initiatives and interests. Concrete elements can emerge from this, and that is important.
Let’s not forget that, since the Mercosur-European Union agreement was signed, almost all Latin American and Caribbean countries have preferential access to the European market. The Social Summit, or Social Forum, is similar, but for civil society: a space where they can discuss classic civil society issues, starting with the very meaning of being civil society. We will, of course, talk about labor rights, a viable economy, and human rights.
The issue of security is undoubtedly one that affects both continents, and the Summit will also include the joint fight against organized crime, corruption, drug trafficking, and human trafficking. What is your commitment in this regard?
We have been supporting peace processes for more than 30 years. Furthermore, our understanding is that whenever we talk about security, we must address two things: the short-term manifestations, but also the root causes. A large part of those root causes is identified in the 2016 agreement. In this regard, we have a very interesting project called Territorial Alliances for Peace with Nature, where we basically try to bring prosperity and investment to areas that were historically under the control of illegal groups, in order to offer alternatives to the people. Here, for example, in an area of Bogotá, there are shops that sell cheese from Caquetá. This is a good example of how we can promote legal economic activities that offer real opportunities.
LEA TAMBIÉN
Our job is to help implement those agreements; we don’t negotiate. We understand that some processes (of ‘total peace’) are progressing well and others not so much, but we remain on board. While those negotiations are taking place, we try, through projects, to attract investment and promote prosperity in those areas, to offer alternatives to illegal economies. That is, approximately, what we are doing. We contribute around $16 million, member states contribute another $6 million, and the Colombian government contributes a similar amount, around $16 million. The big challenge is to work on the link between the environment and insecurity, that is, the issues of illegal mining, alternative crops, combating deforestation, and promoting prosperity based on the legal economy.
What place does migration occupy in this bi-regional agenda, and do you believe that, as happened in Europe, migration flows can be managed jointly?
There are several aspects to migration. One of them is the humanitarian component. Our humanitarian aid office, ECHO, is very active in Colombia and understands the enormous challenge the country faces in receiving so many migrants. In a way, it is a challenge similar to the one we face within the European Union. We see that we share a common vision here: to treat people with respect, guarantee their rights, and empower them to facilitate their integration, whether in the short or long term. I have the impression that the approach to the phenomenon of migration is quite similar.
And we return to what I mentioned at the beginning: a humanistic view, focused on respect for people as individuals with rights and, of course, responsibilities. We are committed to an approach based on human dignity, not on blaming or criminalizing migrants.
There is clearly a convergence of interests between Europe and Latin America on specific issues, but where do you see gaps and which issues should be emphasized?
It may sound a little arrogant, but I think that together we are right. We have assessed what is needed jointly, Europeans and Latin Americans, and I don’t think we are wrong.
We are doing things right, although it is a huge task that takes time.
The key is to move forward with a green, social transition supported by digital transformation. If we don’t address environmental challenges, climate change, biodiversity loss, and pollution, to put it simply, nothing else will make sense. But we must also make progress on the social front, because the root causes of many of this continent’s problems lie in inequality. That is the great challenge.
LEA TAMBIÉN
We are doing things right, although it is a huge task that takes time. In the last two or three years, we have seen developments that do not help: the multilateral system, which is indispensable for sustaining a green, digital, and social economy, is experiencing difficulties. Tensions between the United States and China have affected this framework, through no fault of Europe or Latin America.
Presidents Xi Jinping and Donald Trump at their meeting in South Korea. Foto:EFE
What can be done to address these challenges?
We are quite clear about the major challenges we share. The difficult part is how to tackle them. We have tools that bring us closer together: treaties that guarantee legal certainty, great cultural proximity, investment promotion, cooperation in peace processes, and citizen security. We are doing reasonably well in all these areas, but structural results take time.
The example of the metro is illustrative: when it is ready, it will transform everyday life, but its construction will take years. The same is true of this bi-regional agenda. Every two years, heads of state meet to review progress, and in the meantime there are multiple bilateral meetings that allow us to continue building.
Often, what directly transforms people’s lives happens at the bilateral level: infrastructure, economy, employment. The bi-regional, on the other hand, has less visible but fundamental effects: police cooperation through Ameripol, exchanges between experts, joint reflection on legislation or on how to address phenomena such as social networks. These are processes that are not noticeable on a day-to-day basis, but which have a profound structural impact.
Europe is facing an internal crisis due to the rise of the radical right and Euroscepticism. How do you think this political climate affects foreign policy towards Latin America?
I don’t think it has a significant impact. Each continent has its own electoral rhythms and, in a way, we live in a kind of permanent election. There was a push to the right in Europe, but let’s see who wins in the Netherlands. At the European level, political changes within member states are tempered by EU institutions. The European Parliament has indeed shifted slightly to the right, but that is not fundamentally transforming the orientation of the European Union.
Tensions between the United States and China have affected this framework, through no fault of Europe or Latin America.
In Latin America, as there is less institutionality than in the European Union, for example, political changes can have a slightly greater impact on intercontinental dynamics. When we talk about security today, it is not very different from when there were more left-wing governments in Latin America. In fact, Ameripol was created at that time, a police cooperation mechanism that does not respond to a specific political orientation. That is why I believe that internal developments on each continent do not affect the bicontinental relationship.
LEA TAMBIÉN
What does have a greater influence is the crisis of multilateralism, which does not originate in Europe or Latin America, but rather from external actors. In particular, the tensions between China and the United States, and of course the attitude of Russia, which has effectively thrown international law in the trash.
CAMILO A. CASTILLO — X: @camiloandres894
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